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KRS -- don't discard MSTS anytime soon


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#21 AZ Rail Rat

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Posted 28 November 2007 - 11:51 AM

QUOTE(moose49 @ Nov 27 2007, 1:23 PM) View Post

sniper=jim ward blink.gif


Woops - - - forgot that. blush.gif blush.gif blush.gif

Who the heck can keep up with all these names????

Actually I was thinking of Bob Wirth!!!

#22 ricksan

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Posted 28 November 2007 - 02:18 PM

QUOTE(moose49 @ Nov 28 2007, 9:25 AM) View Post

Counting on you and Marc, Scott, Andy, and others for MSTS-2 content.

That you can count on! biggrin.gif

#23 august1929

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Posted 28 November 2007 - 02:41 PM

QUOTE
Content for RS? Don't count on it.


http://www.german-ra.../krs-gt1_t.html



#24 RSderek

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 09:44 AM

Hello to you all from the UK,

Let me introduce myself.

My name is Derek Siddle and I am currently working on Rail Simulator.
I am new to this forum.

There are many addons currently in the pipeline and now that people have the tools and means to get thir work into the program we are seeing a large amount of community content being created.

I have nothing against MSTS or MSTS2, I have no reason either. I am here in a personal capacity and to provide information if people require it.

Not sure if I am welcome or not, but just thought I'd say hello.

Best regards

Derek

#25 USRailFan

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 11:45 AM

Funny how many of the people who have already made up their opinion about KRS being total junk haven't even tried it yet...

#26 nman281

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 02:05 PM

Derek,
I would like to welcome you to the community and from my part I will say that I am looking forward to KRS. I am willing to give it a shot before I knock it off.
I am sure there will be teething problems, but I dont see either Kuju or EA just dropping out and leaving us hanging. I am an optimist and I am sure sooner or later some people will make the transition towards developing more KRS stuff.
~Nick

#27 Guest_djt_*

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 05:42 PM

QUOTE
I am here in a personal capacity and to provide information if people require it.


Thanks Derek.


#28 pinpuller

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 06:10 PM

Welcome Derek, Perhaps you can keep us up to date with anything that becomes available for RS-USA. I know a lot of you folks have intersts in US rail so no doubt add-ons may be in the future.


#29 Bananarama

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 07:51 PM

Glad to have you aboard, Derek! smile.gif

Cheers!
Marc

#30 burgerbern

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Posted 10 January 2008 - 04:07 AM

QUOTE(USRailFan @ Jan 9 2008, 7:26 PM) View Post

Funny how many of the people who have already made up their opinion about KRS being total junk haven't even tried it yet...



Well i have tried it and to be honest could have spent the money elsewhere, when Kuju with their knowlwdge of developing MSTS comes up with something that is so hard to use, where you cannot even do the simplest of jobs like choose a starting place from a drop down list, pick the time of day, the weather , the consist without having to go in and alter a scenario and which you cannot see more than a trains length ahead in the track monitor , so you cannot see what the switches ahead are lined up for , which in turn causes the sim to boot you out every time you go over one of the switches well i gave up, love the graphics but the control side of things sucks, i deleted it and shelved it

#31 AZ Rail Rat

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Posted 10 January 2008 - 04:32 PM

I downloaded the demo and ran it. I too was disappointed with the track monitor. It seemed so busy, I did not even notice that it did not look ahead very far.

Some questions for Derek or others:

The Demo had no tool tips as one hovers over an engine control. Took a while to find everything. I found no option to turn them on or off. Does the real package have such?

The demo engine had no out-the-window view left or right. Are engine files editable and can such things be added?

What does the entire package have the demo did not, operation wise?

#32 MidnightTrain

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Posted 11 January 2008 - 01:45 AM

I haven't played KRS, and I'm getting mixed reviews about it. Some say that it's already better than MSTS, other say don't waste your time on it. I haven't really decided if I'm going to get it or not. Right now my heart is set on MSTS-X because of the Multiplayer capability and the World of Rails, not to mention the awesome graphics. Those three things is what sold me on MSTS-X.

I may look at KRS when the US Version comes out. Hopefully they will have a Demo of the US Version.

#33 mdeming

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Posted 11 January 2008 - 06:06 AM

QUOTE(USRailFan @ Jan 9 2008, 12:26 PM) View Post

Funny how many of the people who have already made up their opinion about KRS being total junk haven't even tried it yet...



I do that very thing with movies, plays, music, food and other things in life. Word of mouth is one of the best forms of advertising. After what all I have read about KRS, and all the bugs with MSTS I have a wait and see attitude toward it.

#34 jp4712

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Posted 11 January 2008 - 10:20 AM

QUOTE(AZ Rail Rat @ Jan 10 2008, 3:13 PM) View Post

I downloaded the demo and ran it. I too was disappointed with the track monitor. It seemed so busy, I did not even notice that it did not look ahead very far.

Some questions for Derek or others:

The Demo had no tool tips as one hovers over an engine control. Took a while to find everything. I found no option to turn them on or off. Does the real package have such?

The demo engine had no out-the-window view left or right. Are engine files editable and can such things be added?

What does the entire package have the demo did not, operation wise?
Can't help on the first question about the cab - I use the keyboard for everything and as almost everything has the same key input as MSTS I was away. The only control difference is that A and D are swapped (A = accelerate and D = decelerate) so someone uploaded a quick utility at UKTS that swapped them back to MSTS configuration and that was that.

I understand that support for Raildriver is coming soon and it'll be via API, not the screen-read workaround.

Second question about head-out view - that's one of the few differences. To get head-out in MSTS it's arrow key up or down. In RS arrow key up or down zooms the view. Left and right keys move you from one side of the cab to the other. To look around an RS cab, right-click the mouse and drag. To get the head-out view, press SHIFT + 2 and there you are: then once again right-click and drag to pan around.

The best view is view 8 - if you use it, you can fly wherever you like up to about a mile from your train so you can get ahead and do the 'MSTS view 4' thing but wait for the train to come, see it go by, wait for it to disappear into the distance.

The F3 window isn't ideal, but apparenetly it's being addressed in a patch. If you want to see the layout, go to view 9 which (to use MSTS vernacular) the equivalent of having the Activity Editor map viewable in-game in real time.

Are engine files editable - yep. In the downloads on the RS site you can get a blueprint editor that you use to change parameters.

I never played the demo, went straight to the game so I can't help on your question about what's not in the full game that's not in the demo.

Burgerbern is clearly frustrated with RS, that's a shame. For about a week I moaned and bitched about RS and then the penny dropped - THIS IS NOT MSTS2. That's right, you can't pick anywhere on the system to 'explore route'. The basic control similarities mislead you into thinking that everything is the same - it isn't. There are some things in MSTS that are better than RS. Period. But for every thing that's better in MSTS than RS, evenetually you'll find five things that are better in RS than MSTS. For example, the cab views are incredible. The graphics/eye candy are streets ahead. The ability to edit a route easily, in-game. The ability to zoom ahead to see that far-off signal. The smoke particles are a hundred times better. Oh, and it has crashed once since October.

I'm not uncritical of RS, as I say above I was deeply frustrated for a while. I suspect that for the first few weeks the forum boards will be full of anguish and bile as people have to lose some of the functionality of MSTS before they have discovered all the extra functionality in RS. I also think that people will be frustrated by the lack of add-ons compared to six years' worth of MSTS ones. But if you go to UKTS you'll see the tone has settled down a hell of a lot and on the front page there as I type this, out of the 16 most recent uploads eight are for MSTS and eight are for RS.

It's getting there, but recognize that a. ) it isn't perfect; b. ) leaving the emotional as well as technical/content baggage that we're all bringing from MSTS takes a while to get your head around; and c. ) at least these guys are talking to us.

Paul

PS and the best tip of all - I guarantee that next week the RS server on their 'official content' page will be under severe strain, so go there now and download the dev tools and any extra stock that takes your fancy!

#35 nman281

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Posted 11 January 2008 - 12:00 PM

Paul,
I have to admit that yours is probably one of the best and most level headed reply I have seen so far in what now seems like a huge flame war between the MSTS hardcores and RS optimists. I think we need to accept RS with a grain of salt and work on fixing those things that aren't perfect. I guess people fail to realize that this is just another piece of software and like any other software, there are changes that you need to work with and around. Heck there was this huge commotion every time a new version of windows/office/internet explorer came about but eventually everybody just settled down and it was accepted.
So, I am waiting and watching, and hopefully, the whole RS issue will settle down.
If not then MSTS lovers have that and RS will be out there for those who want to try it/have it.
Just my 2 cents in this seemingly growing sea of flame wars over RS.
~Nick


#36 jp4712

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Posted 12 January 2008 - 01:59 AM

With you there, Nick - I'm happy to play MSTS with all the superb add-ons and refinements, equally happy to play RS - maybe I should flame myself? RS really needs that first patch due in the next few weeks to overcome the most obvious niggles such as the derail on trailing points that burgerbern mentioned (RS have confirmed they've fixed this) and being UK-based I can't wait for some of the payware that's coming along (see links below): but we just have to have an open mind, be constructively critical and be happy that RS and MSTS2 are giving our hobby a new lease of life.

Paul

Appendix: UK payware announcements for RS:
http://www.justtrain...uct.asp?pid=289
http://digitaltracti...h...ge&Itemid=1

NB the Digital Traction site includes 11 free scenario downloads for RS

#37 tialho

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Posted 12 January 2008 - 06:57 AM

I was quite critical about KRS when I first got it back in October - I was particularly frustrated by the track monitor and derailments on points. However, after finding out about the 'view 9' track layout from the UKTS forums (this isn't well covered in the literature that came with the game), I'm now getting hooked; IMO, this makes for great switching activities with the ability to set paths at each reversing point, rather than switch by switch as for MSTS. I'm looking forward to see what scenarios will be included with the US content that make use of this functionality.

Another frustration I had was the lack of scenarios - however, a lot more are now becoming available and I find I'm now spending a lot more more time on KRS (probably still using MSTS more, but hey, that's 100+ routes against 4!). My advice would be stick with it - KRS is shaping up to be a great sim; it's just a pity that the initial launch resembled a large scale beta-test (please note that I don't level any criticism at the RS team for this - I know how launch deadlines are, and the support provided by Adam and Derek since has been exemplary!).

Regards,

Tim

PS IMO it's a pity that the route that's being omitted from the US launch is York-Newcastle - I think this is possibly the best route of the initial 4 with regard to scope for scenarios, given the location and time period modelled (but then again, I may be biased as someone who was growing up in the UK in the 70's!).

#38 sniper297

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Posted 12 January 2008 - 08:47 PM

Hey, is this the RailSim forum? Been wondering when that hippie was gonna get around to making one, guess this will have to do for now.

Hmmm, questions, free play;

http://forums.flight...ad.php?t=266814

Working that out now, upcoming patch is supposed to fix trailing point derailments, but the 2D map;

http://forums.flight...ad.php?t=266206

Is better than that silly little F3 window anyway, I never use the F3 except to uncouple cars (and the front coupler for THIS one works out of the box!), since you can set multiple switches up to 2 miles ahead or behind in the 2D map.

USA routes, lessee here;

http://forums.flight...ad.php?t=264108

RS Port Ogden & Northern, 53% more fun than Canton, contains no sticky pineapples, guaranteed to irritate Garber before his morning root beer. devil.gif

Also have an unreasonable misbegotten misrepresentation of a Chicago mass transit route;

http://forums.flight...ad.php?t=266755

So NOW can I discard MSTS? Fossilized remains are starting to stink up the place. blink.gif


#39 RSderek

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 02:36 PM

Hi Guys, sorry for not getting back sooner, had my hands full with family stuff.
Thanks for the welcome, I hope to spend my time posting on here and on the Uk forums. Mind you my wife may have somethign to say about that!
smile.gif

The interface does have tool tips and there is hang out the window camera [shift+2]

I agree there are a number of frustrations that have been address in the Upgrade. We have also tried to document everything we possibly can and the docs download will be expanded also.

regards

Derek